Title: Thomas R. Dunlap Interviews Concerning DDT
Inclusive Dates: 1973-1974

Creator:

• Dunlap, Thomas R., 1943-

Call Number: Audio 915A

Quantity: 12 cassette recordings

Repository:

Wisconsin Historical Society Archives / Wisconsin Center for Film and Theater Research
Contact Information

Archival Locations:

Wisconsin Historical Society (Map)

COLLECTION MAY BE STORED OFF-SITE: see catalog entry to request materials and for additional information.

Abstract:

Thomas R. Dunlap interviews done while researching concerns on the use of DDT (Dichlorodiphenyltrichloroethane). Interviewees include Lorrie Otto, Maurice Van Susteren, Hugh H. Iltis, Orie Loucks, Charles F. Wurster Jr., Joseph J. Hickey, Victor J. Yannacone Jr., R.K. Chapman, E.K. Fisher, and Francis B. Coon.

Note:

There is a use restriction to this material; see the Administrative/Restriction Information portion of this finding aid for details.

Language: English

URL to cite for this finding aid: http://digital.library.wisc.edu/1711.dl/wiarchives.uw-whs-audi00915a

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Use Restrictions

The Hugh H. Iltis (Audio 915A/8, 10) and Victor J. Yannacone Jr. (Audio 915A/9) interviews require their review prior to publication.

Acquisition Information

Presented by Thomas R. Dunlap, 1980. M80-610

DDT (Insecticide) -- WisconsinManuscript collectionSound recordings

Audio   915A/1 (continued)-2	Chapman, R.K. circa 1973-1974
Audio   915A/1	Coon, Francis B. 1973 October 23 Scope and Content Note: Coon was called into the DDT hearings by Ellsworth Fisher to act as an expert on the problems of residue analysis. He expresses his opinion that both sides were very ill-prepared when offering testimony and that the data points also contained much information on chemicals other than DDT. Coon states that he saw himself as a disinterested witness, disagreeing with the smear tactics employed by both sides, but complimenting Van Susteren on keeping control of the hearing.
Audio   915A/6	Fisher, Ellsworth K. circa 1973-1974
Audio   915A/11-12	Hickey, Joseph J. 1973 July 16 Scope and Content Note: After hearing reports of declining bird populations in 1958, Hickey began tests to determine the LD50 (lethal dose for 50 percent of subjects) for robins ingesting DDT, which turned out to be 1/13 the recommended dosage. In 1959, the Interior Department funded a study of bird populations of sprayed and unsprayed urban areas, with robin morality in one area reaching approximately 89 percent. His studies of Wauwatosa, Janesville, and Shorewood showed the density of birds was inversely proportional to the amount sprayed. In 1962, Hickey began studying the collapsing birthrates of peregrine falcons, finding no young falcons and confirming similar findings in Europe. After much study, Hickey was convinced by 1968 that DDT was causing the thinning of egg shells, with evidence of this dating back to 1947. That year, Hickey presented his case to the State Agriculture Committee, but they were not convinced. Seeing no action coming from the government, conservationists began a lawsuit to force action, which Hickey spends the remainder of the tape recounting. Hickey then discusses his reading of Robert Rudd's manuscript, "Pesticides and the Living Landscape," and how he pushed to get it published, despite objecting to the "emotionalism" of the writing. He also discusses the work of Rachel Carlson, wishing not to besmirch her character, but criticized her reliance on research assistance who would bring back quotes out of context, which she would use in her work.
Audio   915A/8, 10	Iltis, Hugh H. 1973 June 19 Scope and Content Note: Iltis and Joseph Hickey formed the Wisconsin Chapter of Nature Conservancy around 1957, as more people were becoming more interested in the increased rarity of birds and insects. Iltis is heavily critical of the way agricultural research is tied to corporations and the hesitancy of others in speaking out on the issue, calling "Silent Spring" the Watergate of the agricultural establishment. He points out that graduate students at the University of Wisconsin's Entomology Department were prohibited from reading or discussing the book. In 1967, Iltis was sent a letter asking if he would be a co-plantiff in the upcoming DDT hearings and gave his testimony in December 1969. He also comments on the effort Yannacone spent coaching the witness, stating that these efforts really won them the case. Iltis comments that one of the strengths of the anti-DDT forces was the scientific spirit and friendship among those involved. As a group, they decided to bring in Göran Löfroth from Sweden, to provide his scientific testimony on the presence of DDT in human milk. This testimony gets published in the New York Times, and soon reporters from all over begin to swarm the hearings.
Audio   915A/4-5	Loucks, Orie 1974 February 5 Scope and Content Note: Loucks worked as ecologist for the Canadian government in the 1950s, spraying forests with DDT to control spruce budworm, but began to question the program based on financial and environmental concerns. He came to the University of Wisconsin in 1962 and eventually got involved with the Citizens Natural Resources Association of Wisconsin, participating heavily in the 1966 symposium and convincing the University's entomologists to participate. With the help of Lorrie Otto, the CNRA and EDF joined forces to pursue the case against DDT in the Wisconsin judicial system. Loucks discusses the turbulence caused by Yannacone inside the EDF as a result of his unorthodox and brash legal opinions, causing the group to lose the trust of the Ford Foundation and the Audubon Society (who both saw the organization as a convenient intermediary to pursue environmental lawsuits). The witnesses they selected help push forward their case. Loucks also describes how the EDF began using systems analysis to prove the public harm caused by DDT. After the success of the legal proceedings in Wisconsin, the issue went to the Environmental Protection Agency and the United States Department of Agriculture. Loucks also discusses the effect Rachel Carson's "Silent Spring" had on entomology, but also notes that many scientists, due to the repercussions from losing grant money, were hesitant to look into the issues concerning the use of DDT. However, he encountered nearly no hostility from his colleagues regarding his activism.
Audio   915A/2 (continued), 6	Otto, Lorrie 1974 February 18 Scope and Content Note: Otto first heard of DDT in 1945 when her husband was interning in Portland, Oregon, and was cautioned against use of the chemical because it was not well-studied and its toxic properties relatively unknown. She moved to Milwaukee around 1950 and had an arborist spray DDT on 60 trees infected with spruce gall adelgids. Many of the birds on her 60-acre lot vanished, but she did not see any die the first year. The next spring, she found numerous convulsing birds on her property and noticed an absence of frogs and salamanders. Soon after the Village of Bayside began helicopter spraying DDT widely, so she went to the village board, compelling them to establish a committee to investigate the issue. After getting much resistance from the village board, Otto went to the press, forcing a short moratorium on spraying in many areas. The legislature was reluctant to ban DDT outright, however, so a lawsuit was pursued.
Audio   915A/7	Van Susteren, Maurice 1974 December 10 Scope and Content Note: Van Susteren discusses the use of Wisconsin laws regarding water pollution in the legal case against the use of DDT and why pursuing a public nuisance case would have proved more difficult. While working for the Department of Natural Resources, he assigned himself to the DDT case, as there was no other lawyer with the necessary scientific background. Hearing on DDT began in 1951, with an average of 400 taking place each year. Van Susteren eventually ruled against the use of DDT in 1970, while noting that the DNR either stayed out of the issue or discouraged him for acting alone.
Audio   915A/3	Wurster, Charles F. 1973 December 21 Scope and Content Note: Wurster had been an naturalist since his youth and did biochemical research on lipids in birds at Dartmouth College, causing him to oppose the spraying of DDT as a means of combating Dutch elm disease, as it was ineffective for this purpose. After coming to the State University of New York in 1965, he began studying DDT full-time. He got together with Yannacone to take legal action against the spraying of DDT, also incorporating the Environmental Defense Fund in 1967. Wurster then discusses the legal proceedings, commenting on the raising of funds, the relative ease of finding scientists prepared to provide testimony, and the lack of preparation from the defense. Environmental lawsuits were seen as novel then, increasing interest in the issue, and leading to a national ban.
Audio   915A/9	Yannacone, Victor J. 1973 December 21 Scope and Content Note: Yannacone had pursued many environmental lawsuits in the 1960s, but was reluctant to tackle DDT until his wife convinced him to do so in 1966. After the judge refused to sign his complaint, Yannacone went to Charles Wurster to get his help in the case. Yannacone discusses in detail the formation of the Environmental Defense Fund. At the end of 1966, the EDF tries to compel the United States Department of Agriculture to cease and desist from recommending DDT for Dutch elm disease. This action quickly failed, but convinced the organization to pursue equity litigation which invoked the 9th amendment and the notion of the public's right to an un-degraded ecosystem. Eventually, they found a Wisconsin law relating to water pollution which suited their purposes. However, Yannacone eventually left the EDF due to numerous conflicts with Wurster (whom he also praised for sacrificing his career for the environmental movement). Yannacone spends the remainder of the tape lamenting about how the EDF had been "institutionalized" under the direction of the Ford Foundation, eventually losing most of its most dedicated staff.