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Audio 881A
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Series: Clifford Krueger and Carl W. Thompson
65 minutes
: Interview with Republican Krueger and Democrat Thompson conducted December 9, 1980; including information on each man's youth, political influences, Progressive activity in Dane and Lincoln counties, Progressive leaders, and related topics.
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Tape/Side
1/1
Time
00:00
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Introduction
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Tape/Side
1/1
Time
00:30
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Krueger's introduction
: Origins of Krueger family in Germany.
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Tape/Side
1/1
Time
01:30
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Born in St. Joseph's Hospital in Madison
: Father worked in cheese cooperative in town of Burke (Dane County), but soon moved back to Merrill.
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Tape/Side
1/1
Time
02:30
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Education
: Attended Merrill Public Schools; two years in commercial school in Wausau and Merrill.
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Tape/Side
1/1
Time
03:05
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Origins of Thompson family
: Norwegian immigrants to Minnesota and Wisconsin. Father was Agriculture Professor in Minnesota and South Dakota, then with Agriculture Department in Washington, D.C. After father's death moved to Stoughton and was educated in Stoughton and at the University of Wisconsin in Madison.
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Tape/Side
1/1
Time
04:40
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Thompson describes influences
: Courses and debating in high school important as well as father's extensive library in political science.
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Tape/Side
1/1
Time
05:35
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Krueger describes influences
: Republican family tradition (La Follette wing) but more important was the influence of grandparents and their lives as peasants in Germany.
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Tape/Side
1/1
Time
07:25
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Krueger grandparents' move to America
: Grandmother refused to raise her sons for the Kaiser's army and made the move to America a condition of marriage.
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Tape/Side
1/1
Time
08:40
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Krueger's first political involvement
: Ran for Lincoln County Treasurer as Progressive in 1940 but lost. In 1941 elected Alderman in Merrill. [Interviewer's note: Krueger was elected alderman in 1946].
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Tape/Side
1/1
Time
09:35
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Thompson's first politcal involvement
: Active as university student in organizational meetings of Progressive Party and Young Progressive Club on campus as well as in 1934 campaign.
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Tape/Side
1/1
Time
12:25
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Thompson works for Phil La Follette
: Originally as custodian for Governor's garage and then as clerk in the Governor's office.
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Tape/Side
1/1
Time
13:05
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Activities of Young Progressive Club on UW Campus
: Took over independent political organization (i.e., non-fraternity) after struggle between progressives and communists. Dominated student government and newspaper for a time.
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Tape/Side
1/1
Time
14:25
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Thompson's early candidacies
: Ran for alderman in Madison and was opposed by Wisconsin State Journal as a carpetbagging student. Later became alderman, then City Attorney in Stoughton. After returning from the Army after World War II ran for Congress as a Democrat and then for Governor. Elected to the Assembly in 1952 and to the State Senate in 1959 special election.
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Tape/Side
1/1
Time
17:25
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Krueger describes influence of Robert M. La Follette Sr.
: Krueger joined Progressive Party largely because of the inspiration of the elder La Follette.
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Tape/Side
1/1
Time
18:50
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Young Progressive convention in Merrill
: First time Thompson and Krueger met. Krueger presided and Thompson made a speech. Krueger pointed out that he was probably only one there without formal education.
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Tape/Side
1/1
Time
20:15
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Rival delegations from Milwaukee at Young Progressive conventions
: Two delegations would arrive from Milwaukee, one Socialist, one Progressive, and both demand to be seated.
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Tape/Side
1/1
Time
20:55
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End of Tape 1, Side 1
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Tape/Side
1/2
Time
00:00
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Introduction
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Tape/Side
1/2
Time
00:35
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Krueger on Socialists and Progressive Coalition
: Socialism in Wisconsin due to German immigration after 1848. Progressives a coalition including farmers, laboring people and university people.
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Tape/Side
1/2
Time
03:30
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Thompson on character of Progressive Party
: Lists influences including Robert La Follette Sr., World War I, the reforms of Gov. Francis McGovern, populism, the Depression, and the milk strike. Because of the variety of influences, party attracted a variety of people. The Farmer Labor Progressive Federation represented urban wing of Party. La Follette Sr.'s support had been largely rural.
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Tape/Side
1/2
Time
06:40
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Thompson anecdote about influence of depression
: Anecdote of Phil La Follette telling Thompson that when wallets were thick the “ins” stayed in, when wallets were thin the “ins” were out. Discontent with existing conditions was the base of Progressive support.
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Tape/Side
1/2
Time
08:30
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Progressive Party activity in Lincoln County
: In 1937, Krueger's father elected sheriff on Progressive ticket. Practically entire courthouse turned Progressive and even in 1946 majority of county officers still Progressives.
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Tape/Side
1/2
Time
10:25
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Spirit of Progressive Party
: Krueger saw Party not just as a political party. A sense of brotherhood permeated the party, though without the ritual associated with a regular lodge.
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Tape/Side
1/2
Time
12:50
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Dissolution of Progressive Party at Portage in 1946
: Krueger describes picture of himself and a friend sitting under Lincoln County standard at Portage convention. Lincoln County supported Robert La Follette Jr.'s decision to return to Republican Party.
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Tape/Side
1/2
Time
13:40
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Progressive Party activity in Dane County
: Swept courthouse in 1934. Progressives very strong in Dane County.
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Tape/Side
1/2
Time
14:25
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Problems of integrating Progressives into two old parties
: Bitterness from 1938 fusion movement on Progressive side, and fears of radicalism and La Follettism on stalwart side.
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Tape/Side
1/2
Time
15:55
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Krueger's relations with Republicans
: First ran for Senate in 1942 as Progressive and lost to Republican. In 1946, ran as Republican and won primary over the Republican who had won in 1942. That Republican then ran as independent in general election, but Krueger won.
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Tape/Side
1/2
Time
19:30
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Thompson's support in early Democratic campaigns
: In both his congressional and gubernatorial campaigns, Thompson owed more to Progressive support than to Democratic support.
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Tape/Side
1/2
Time
20:55
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Formation of National Progressives of America (NPA)
: Krueger's father attended the meeting in the Stock Pavilion. Time was not right to start the movement and trappings were controversial. Thompson claims Phil's desire to distance himself from Franklin Roosevelt's foreign policy helped motivate him to start movement.
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Tape/Side
1/2
Time
24:00
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Isolationism
: Wisconsin was isolationist until Pearl Harbor, largely because of immigrant heritage. That tradition influenced Robert La Follette Jr.'s decision to return to the Republican Party.
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Tape/Side
1/2
Time
26:40
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End of Tape 1, Side 2
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Tape/Side
2/1
Time
00:00
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Introduction
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Tape/Side
2/1
Time
00:30
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Thompson on Robert La Follette Jr.'s return to Republican Party
: Met Bob Jr. in Washington in summer of 1945 and discussed the situation. Bob Jr. felt Democrats were not yet strong enough and that Progressive Party almost dead. He acknowledged difficulty of running in Republican primary but overestimated his strength as incumbent. All in all a better statesman than politician.
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Tape/Side
2/1
Time
04:10
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Thompson on Phil La Follette
: A good speaker who knew how to excite a crowd; loved to campaign. At the same time, he wanted to put through meaningful programs, and understood how to govern.
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Tape/Side
2/1
Time
06:10
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Thompson on Robert La Follette Jr.
: He spoke like a lecturer and did not like politics, though he did like Washington and working in the Senate. Sharp contrast between the brothers.
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Tape/Side
2/1
Time
07:25
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Krueger on La Follette brothers
: Bob Jr. more sedate, probably the intellectual of the two. Phil very intelligent, but quite different from his brother.
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Tape/Side
2/1
Time
08:25
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Krueger on Progressive leaders
: Includes Ted Dammen (Secretary of State), Sol Levitan (State Treasurer), and John Reynolds (Attorney General). Progressive Party failed to develop cadre of leadership other than the La Follettes. Loomis's election and premature death a turning point in downfall of the party; had he lived, another group of leaders might have emerged.
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Tape/Side
2/1
Time
14:05
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Thompson names other Progressive leaders
: Andy Biemiller (former Socialist and later head of AFL-CIO's COPE), Paul Alfonsi (Speaker of the Assembly), Merlin Hull, and Barney Gehrmann (Congressmen). Vernon Thomson a leader of the Stalwarts at the time.
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Tape/Side
2/1
Time
16:35
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End of Tape 2, Side 1. End of Interview
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Audio 890A
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Series: Clifford Krueger
52 minutes
: Interview conducted February 18, 1981, concerning Lincoln County politics in the 1930s-40s, political fund raising, Krueger's reasons for joining the Republican Party in 1946, and other topics.
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Tape/Side
1/1
Time
00:00
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Introduction
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Tape/Side
1/1
Time
00:30
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Leaders of the Progressive Party in Lincoln County
: John Schewe, a self-educated farmer, and Mrs. Angie Hildebrand, the Party Secretary and very active in community affairs in Tomahawk, most prominent leaders. The Progressive and Republican parties were well-organized at the precinct level though the Democrats were not.
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Tape/Side
1/1
Time
03:55
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Young Progressive element
: Beginnings of Krueger's own political involvement. Young Progressives did basic organizational work: raised funds, distributed tabloids and sponsored events. One summer (1938) Young Progressives put on 3-day carnival show which raised $1200 for county and state Progressive parties.
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Tape/Side
1/1
Time
08:15
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Progressives oust Republicans in Lincoln County courthouse
: Carry all but two offices: county clerk and register of deeds.
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Tape/Side
1/1
Time
08:45
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Fund raising techniques
: In addition to the carnival (probably in 1938, since Young Progressives were not formally organized in 1936) the Young Progressives traveled around the county organizing card parties--essentially providing entertainment to all corners of the county on behalf of the Progressive Party.
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Tape/Side
1/1
Time
10:10
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Relationship of Lincoln County Party to state Progressive Party
: Due to the circumstances of the Progressive Party's birth, the relationship was very close. Much of the $1200 raised at the carnival in 1938 was given to the state Party.
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Tape/Side
1/1
Time
11:35
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More fund raising
: In 1936, Lincoln County Progressives raffled off a Pontiac and made about $800. In 1938, they had the carnival.
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Tape/Side
1/1
Time
13:05
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Father (Emil Krueger) elected sheriff in 1936
: Figures known statewide campaigned throughout the state. Tabloids were campaign documents. Young people distributed them to save postage. They distributed them near churches on Sundays, but were careful to never pass them out on church property itself.
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Tape/Side
1/1
Time
15:35
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Father's political career
: Ran as Republican in 1934, but lost. In 1936, was elected as Progressive re-elected in 1938. Prohibited by law from running in 1940.
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Tape/Side
1/1
Time
16:40
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Loomis and La Follette very active in 1940 campaign
: Krueger ran for Lincoln County treasurer; state speakers very active. Krueger speculates rigorous campaign activity could have led to Loomis' early death (in 1942 after election as Governor).
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Tape/Side
1/1
Time
17:15
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Role of state speakers in Progressive campaigns
: State speakers would draw large crowds. Other Progressives who did this type of thing: Sol Levitan (State Treasurer), Ted Dammenn (Secretary of State), and Ralph Immell (Phil La Follette's Adjutant General). Immell became a force himself. He was hard-working in solving problems throughout the state and had lots of contact with constituents. Usually more than one speaker at this type of event. Progressive congressmen participated as well--Barney Gehrmann and a “railroad man” from La Crosse [Gardner R. Withrow].
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Tape/Side
1/1
Time
21:10
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Impact of Amlie-Ekern 1938 primary in Lincoln County
: Memory vague but thinks Ekern probably stronger in that area. Amlie regarded as too liberal and some thought he was even a communist.
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Tape/Side
1/1
Time
23:20
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Communist activity in Lincoln County in late 1930s
: Some communists in Lincoln County. Some claimed to be communists just to attract attention. There were Latvians, Lithuanians, and Russians in the county and Emil Krueger as sheriff had to keep an eye on them for the FBI. A lot of this the product of fear and hysteria. Never had to send anyone back to Russia.
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Tape/Side
1/1
Time
26:30
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End of Tape 1, Side 1
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Tape/Side
1/2
Time
00:00
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Introduction
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Tape/Side
1/2
Time
00:30
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1940 gubernatorial primary
: Krueger and Young Progressives supported Paul Alfonsi who was from the area and a good speaker. But in general election, Young Progressives committed themselves to Loomis.
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Tape/Side
1/2
Time
01:35
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Loomis' rumored commitment to run as Republican in 1944
: Krueger always felt that the Republican Party should be the Progressive Party. One of the troubles with the Progressive Party was that it was viewed as the La Follette Party. Loomis' election marked the beginning of new or at least different blood into the party.
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Tape/Side
1/2
Time
05:55
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Degree of unification among candidates
: Very unified; strong emphasis to vote straight ticket. 1936 strong effort by state party to recruit candidates and encourage competition at county level. Wanted to make strong showing in the primary.
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Tape/Side
1/2
Time
07:55
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Krueger's role in Young Progressives as liason between County Party and Young Progressives
: Even as a candidate, Krueger remained active in Young Progressives. Affiliated with state Young Progressives, which was largely dominated by University crowd from Madison. One of the state-wide conventions was in Merrill. Young Progressives in Lincoln County remained very close over the years. They were nucleus of Krueger's beginning in politics.
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Tape/Side
1/2
Time
12:50
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Krueger's political campaigns in 1940s
: Elected alderman in Merrill in 1946 as preparation for 1946 State Senate race. One of the reasons he ran for county treasurer in 1940 was to prepare for 1942 State Senate race. State Senate always the goal.
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Tape/Side
1/2
Time
14:55
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Emil Krueger's impressions of 1938 National Progressives of America (NPA) convention at Madison
: No particular comment. Emil Krueger not as interested as his son in Progressive movement. Had Emil had steady employment he probably would never have run for sheriff. Tiny remembers pictures of the convention, the symbol and Republican criticism.
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Tape/Side
1/2
Time
16:50
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Krueger's reasons for entering Republican Party rather than Democratic Party after dissolution of Progressive Party in 1946
: Real Progressive Movement was in the Republican Party and Republican Party is big enough for diversity. La Follettes were not anti-business, just against injustice. Democrats were as bitter enemies of the Progressives as the Republicans and sometimes more so. The Democrats took advantage of Progressive "limbo" after 1946. Krueger had to fight to get back into the Republican Party. Bob La Follette Sr. would turn over in his grave if he knew Progressives had joined Democratic Party.
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Tape/Side
1/2
Time
24:45
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End of Tape 1, Side 2. End of Interview
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Audio 901A
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Series: Roland E.H. Kannenberg
55 minutes
: Interview conducted May 29, 1981, with information on the emergence and organization of the Progressive Party, Kannenberg's own legislative campaigns and causes, his philosophy of government, Huey Long, the Union Party, Progressive leaders, and related topics.
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Tape/Side
1/1
Time
00:00
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Introduction
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Tape/Side
1/1
Time
00:30
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Personal background
: One of twelve children, born in Kenosha County in 1907, and his family moved to Marathon County when Kannenberg was about a year old. Educated in a rural school with one room and one teacher for the first eight grades, and then graduated from Wausau High School in 1926. Did well in school and participated on oratory and the debate team.
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Tape/Side
1/1
Time
02:50
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Early political interests
: Developed an early interest in politics, government and the problems of farmers in conversations with his father and others working on the farm. Worked way through high school in a restaurant owned by Herman A. Marsh who had been elected a Socialist Assemblyman during World War I. The restaurant became a gathering spot for town and county political figures. Because of that, Kannenberg came into contact with the problems of farming and working people who were interested in bettering their lives through governmental action.
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Tape/Side
1/1
Time
04:40
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First political involvement
: Kannenberg was asked to respresent police and firement in their fight to avoid pay cuts during the Depression about 1929 or 1930. He was successful and became a spokesman for working people and farmers--especially the Farmer's Union and the Milk Pool. Roland Kannenberg active in his brother Ernest's Assembly campaign in 1928.
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Tape/Side
1/1
Time
08:00
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Roland Kannenberg's own campaigns
: In 1930, ran against Henry Ellenbrecker for the Assembly as a Progressive Republican. Kannenberg lost, but ran a strong campaign. In 1932, he ran against Senator Otto Mueller in a recall election. Kannenberg felt money beat him in 1932.
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Tape/Side
1/1
Time
09:20
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Election to the State Senate
: Kannenberg declared his candidacy against Mueller immediately after his defeat, and ran an extensive two year campaign. District at that time included Lincoln and Marathon Counties.
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Tape/Side
1/1
Time
10:05
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Origins of Progressive Party
: Kannenberg's campaign coincided with third party rumblings in Wisconsin and the nation. Kannenberg spoke around the state with such national figures as Gerald Nye and William Lane of North Dakots, Clerence Dill of Washington, and James Reed of Missouri. Kannenberg supported the emerging Union Party with William Lemke of North Dakota as presidential nominee [Union Party only active in 1936]. Urged government support for those in farm bloc and labor that needed it.
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Tape/Side
1/1
Time
11:55
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Organization of a Progressive Rally
: Rallies would bill a national speaker and their state and local speakers. Kannenberg spoke several times with both of the La Follettes.
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Tape/Side
1/1
Time
13:35
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Kannenberg's role in organization of third party
: Kannenberg played a major role, realizing that the two old parties were owned like a piece of beefsteak by the great money powers. In contrast, Progressives made do with small donations from working people. In 1934, Kannenberg's successful Senate campaign cost $26.10 for printed materials and newspaper ads. Instead of money his campaign stressed meeting the people and delivering a message. His biggest issue was the mortgage moratorium bill which was passed after a tough fight in the Senate.
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Tape/Side
1/1
Time
15:10
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Other Senate issues
: Kannenberg urged broadening of access to higher education promoting University extension. Supported the Wisconsin Development Authority, bringing elecrical power to rural areas and small municipalities. These issues aroused the opposition of money -- and money was very strong in elections. Supported Roosevelt when he was right and opposed him when he was wrong. Opposed plowing under of crops because distribution was the problem, not overproduction.
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Tape/Side
1/1
Time
18:35
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Progressive support during the 1930s
: People came from miles around to attend political meetings and Kannenberg often made 3 or 4 speeches in a day. People came because they were in trouble and looking for solutions. Progressives used the powers of government to put people to work so they could feed their families and educate their children. The Progressive Party was a good party and it was too bad it could not stay together.
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Tape/Side
1/1
Time
20:20
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Kannenberg's philosophy of government
: Worried about contemporary lack of concern for the cause of the poor. Kannenberg's social philosophy rooted in Cristian ethics -- “He who helps the least of mine helps me.” His concern as Senator was to help the poorest of poor. The alternative could lead to mindless violence of poor against wealthy [Mr. Kannenberg wants to stress he does not advocate such violence, he only sees it as a frightening possibility]. There were several examples of this type of violence during the Great Depression. The American nation needs a restoration of Christian philosophy of protecting the poor or hard times are ahead.
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Tape/Side
1/1
Time
26:40
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End of Tape 1, Side 1
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Tape/Side
1/2
Time
00:00
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Introduction
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Tape/Side
1/2
Time
00:30
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Huey Long
: Phil La Follette's national efforts did not compare well to Huey Long's efforts in regard to helping the poor. Long promised to confiscate the profits of war and not allow the rich to get richer while the poor gave their lives. Once wars were no longer profitable, they would no longer be fought. Kannenberg says that Walter Graunke of Wausau was to be Long's running mate in 1936. Kannenberg sponsered resolutions in State Senate wishing. Long a quick recovery after the shooting and then offering condolences to his family.
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Tape/Side
1/2
Time
04:35
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Other third parties
: Farmer Labor party in Minnesota, Non-partisan League and Fusion party in New York all advocated redistribution of wealth in United States. Maldistribution of wealth continues to be major problem in country and the world today.
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Tape/Side
1/2
Time
07:20
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Huey Long
: Long was not a fascist, but a great leader. He had great concern for poor people and was passionately opposed to war. Problems with money often lead to war.
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Tape/Side
1/2
Time
09:55
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Union Party
: Kannenberg campaigned for Lemke through the Fox River Valley. Lemke was not as strong as Long and did not advocate a redistribution of wealth to the extent Long did. People were looking for a leader, but Lemke did not impress. Some other Progressives did not have strong enough program. Kannenberg campaigned for Lemke in the hope that the Union party would develop strong party such as Huey Long's.
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Tape/Side
1/2
Time
12:30
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Phil and Bob La Follette
: Both La Follettes truly committed to the common man. Not as dynamic as Huey Long or some of the others. When Kannenberg convinced La Follette (Phil) that a bill was a good bill, La Follette would support him. Bob La Follette was a good man, but somewhat alone in the Senate, because of the opposition of wealth.
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Tape/Side
1/2
Time
14:30
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Walter Graunke
: A great orator who helped lots of people. He earned his money as a lawyer working hard, but he donated lots of his money as a lawyer to the cause.
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Tape/Side
1/2
Time
15:20
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Samuel Sigman and David Sigman
: Dedicated labor people, but primarily for the organized groups that hired them.
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Tape/Side
1/2
Time
16:20
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Tom Amlie
: Kannenberg spoke several times with Amlie and remembers clearly Amlie's philosophy of production-for-use. Kannenberg spoke on behalf of Farmer Labor Progressive Federation but did not have close relations.
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Tape/Side
1/2
Time
18:15
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Gerald Boileau
: Congressman from Wausau and Kannenberg campaigned with him during several elections. Kannenberg saw Boileau a few weeks before he died in 1981 and suggested that they get back and bring Progressive ideals.
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Tape/Side
1/2
Time
20:05
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Tom Duncan
: Kannenberg and Duncan did not always agree, but remained friends.
Duncan opposed Kannenberg's University extension plan. A very able man.
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Tape/Side
1/2
Time
21:10
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William Evjue
: Also differed on University extension. Kannenberg implies Evjue was parochial Madisonian but concludes that he was a good liberal.
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Tape/Side
1/2
Time
22:50
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1937 special session
: Kannenberg disagrees with criticism of Progressives “ramming” program through, arguing that when legislators were only making $100 a month they did not want to waste time down in Madison, Kannenberg and other Progressives knew that enactment of Progressive program would bring out the money power of the opposition, but they did not realize how much.
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Tape/Side
1/2
Time
26:00
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Overall impact of Progressive Party
: Great service to the country. Pushed Roosevelt into many of his liberal laws and so helped prolong the life of this country. Modern liberals do not compare well.
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Tape/Side
1/2
Time
28:00
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End of Tape 1, Side 2. End of Interview
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Audio 902A
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Series: Paul R. Alfonsi
87 minutes
: Interview conducted May 27, 1981, concerning politics in Iron and Vilas counties, Alfonsi's experiences as a legislator in the 1930s, Progressive meetings and leaders, other third party efforts, and related matters.
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Tape/Side
1/1
Time
00:00
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Introduction
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Tape/Side
1/1
Time
00:30
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Family and educational background
: Born in Pence (Iron County) on February 13, 1908, of Corsican parents. Father came in 1906 to work the iron ore mines. Mother came next year and they were married. Alfonsi educated in Pence public schools and graduated from Hurley High School. Then went to Whitewater State College, graduating in 1927.
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Tape/Side
1/1
Time
02:00
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First employment
: Started teaching at Washburn High School (Bayfield County, Wisconsin) at age nineteen. Taught commercial subjects and coached debate and forensics.
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Tape/Side
1/1
Time
02:25
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College debating
: Captained the debate team two of his three years there and was college orator one year. Influenced his interest in politics.
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Tape/Side
1/1
Time
02:55
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First political involvement
: At Washburn Alfonsi met Representative Robert Nixon, progressive Republican leader in the Assembly, and became close friends. In 1932 election incumbent from Iron and Vilas counties suffered a stroke. Alfonsi won a five way Republican primary spending $44. Ran a personal door to door campaign and went on to beat the Democrat and an independent Republican.
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Tape/Side
1/1
Time
06:00
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Formation of Progressive Party
: Before 1934 election progressive Republicans decided to form their own party. In three months they had collected several hundred thousand signatures. Alfonsi felt that the new party would clarify progressive position on issues. Rallies during that first campaign were very successful because of the enthusiasm for the new party.
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Tape/Side
1/1
Time
08:40
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Alfonsi's personal campaigns
: 1936 campaign very successful; Progressives elected governor, winning a plurality of forty-six in the Assembly and sixteen in the Senate. Alfonsi became Speaker. In 1938 Progressives hurt by Duncan incident and Phil La Follette's national ambitions. Encouraged Republicans and Democrats to form coalition against Progressives. Alfonsi himself had little trouble in his personal campaigns.
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Tape/Side
1/1
Time
11:45
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Legislative experiences
: Owed his election to the support of labor, especially the miners in
Iron County. Spent much of his first term learning rules of procedure--helped by Robert Nixon. Credits his knowledge of rules to much of his legislative success. During his first session sponsored bill compelling the mining companies to establish safety standards for the miners. Also involved in educational and conservation issues.
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Tape/Side
1/1
Time
14:00
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Progressive floor leader
: Robert Nixon, Progressive leader in the 1933 session, sent to Washington and Alfonsi became floor for the 1935 session.
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Tape/Side
1/1
Time
14:45
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Speaker of the Assembly
: Jorge Carow (P-Ladysmith), Speaker in the 1935 session, died after the 1936 election. Alfonsi decided to go for the Speaker's chair. Four sought the Progressive Party endorsement and Alfonsi received it on the second ballot. Although there were only 46 Progressives, Alfonsi counted on the support of four Democrats to win 50-49. He also had to use “a little bit of Corsican intuition” to trick one member to change his vote from Victor Nehs to Alfonsi. Being elected speaker one of the proud moments of Alfonsi's career.
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Tape/Side
1/1
Time
19:45
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1937 regular session
: Progressives only had 46 votes, but Alfonsi appointed Charles Perry, R-West Allis, chairman of Judiciary Committee. Perry controlled six or seven Republican votes but even so Progressive program defeated. That required a special session in September 1937 where the program passed with the help of Perry's Republican votes. Coalition of Democrats and Republicans primarily interested in embarrassing Governor La Follette; they did not care if anything passed or not.
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Tape/Side
1/1
Time
24:20
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End of Tape 1, Side 1
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Tape/Side
1/2
Time
00:00
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Introduction
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Tape/Side
1/2
Time
00:30
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Relations with Governor Phil La Follette
: Main complaint with La Follette's office was that Assembly leadership
not consulted in advance often enough. One specific fight Alfonsi had with La Follette involved a bill Alfonsi drafted on relief payments. La Follette said he supported it but would Alfonsi wait a little. Then Alfonsi found out that La Follette had given the bill to Sen. Philip Nelson, R-Superior, in an effort to get him on the Progressive side.
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Tape/Side
1/2
Time
04:25
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Assessment of Phil La Follette as Governor
: La Follette most astute governor of the state that Alfonsi served under. But unlike his brother Bob, Phil La Follette was opinionated and somewhat egotistical. Bob was the statesman; Phil was the politician. Personalities of both La Follette and Tom Duncan hurt their relationships with legislators but both were respected for their abilities. They kept everything to themselves.
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Tape/Side
1/2
Time
06:10
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Assessment of Phil La Follette as a campaigner
: No equal. La Follette was a master with a crowd. Made as many as five speeches a day and drew tremendous crowds. Used plain language and gestures to appeal to his audience. His speaking style differed from that of his father Robert M. La Follette Sr. in that old Bob was more of a showman.
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Tape/Side
1/2
Time
08:30
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National Progressives of America
: Alfonsi not involved and attempted to discourage the new party. Alfonsi never understood why Phil La Follette did it, citing all the problems that face a new party, especially in Presidential years and ballot access.
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Tape/Side
1/2
Time
09:40
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Party organization in Iron and Vilas Counties
: Organized at precinct level. Very easy in his home county, Iron County; more difficult in Vilas County, which was conservative. Cites lack of outside distractions on voters which made belonging to a party more attractive. Judge Carter from Eagle River helped organize Vilas County. Held frequent meetings and Alfonsi would come back every weekend. Kept year round headquarters in Iron County, not in Vilas.
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Tape/Side
1/2
Time
11:55
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Keeping in touch with constituents
: Alfonsi knew that people had problems who could not get down to Madison so he invited them to see him at home. When he would get home on Fridays there would be a line of cars outside his house. He would then help resolve those problems. This helped Alfonsi keep in close contact with
his constituents which paid dividends as it was a form of campaigning year round.
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Tape/Side
1/2
Time
13:40
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Campaign tactics
: Radio out of the question during the thirties and very little newspaper. Mostly personal contact and small card. Iron County a melting pot and many could not speak English. Alfonsi would give them a small card with his name on it which they took with them into polls. Italians and Finns strong supporters because of their gratitude for Alfonsi's help.
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Tape/Side
1/2
Time
16:20
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Characteristics of Iron County
: Primarily labor but not organized in the early thirties. Alfonsi's father did not belong to the union and refused to work for the WPA. He went out into the woods and cut wood instead.
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Tape/Side
1/2
Time
17:55
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“Alfonsi Highway”
: When Alfonsi first came to the legislature, Highway 77 out of Hurley was not paved, just covered with slag rock, creating a large dirt problem. Highway Department refused Alfonsi's request to oil the road so he introduced a bill forcing them to do it. The bill passed and the road became known as Alfonsi Highway.
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Tape/Side
1/2
Time
20:40
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Campaign financing
: 1932 campaign had cost $44.00 and most later campaigns cost around $1500
or $1600. Only one campaign cost more than $2000. Most contributions from friends and supporters. (This may include campaigns in the 1950s and 1960s as much as the 1930s.)
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Tape/Side
1/2
Time
22:10
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Large Progressive meetings
: 1938 meeting at Pence with Bob La Follette. Had arranged for parking for about 1000 people but 3000 came. People were parking a mile away and walking. In 1936 Phil La Follette spoke to about 700 people in Pence. Ralph Immell, Barney Gehrmann also spoke. Local candidates would also be introduced at these meetings and they could speak if they wanted. Meetings mainly speeches though sometimes there would be beer.
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Tape/Side
1/2
Time
26:00
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End of Tape 1, Side 2
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Tape/Side
2/1
Time
00:00
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Introduction
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Tape/Side
2/1
Time
00:30
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Governor's race in 1940
: Progressive Party at low ebb in 1940. Republican Julius Heil running for a second term. Former Attorney General Orland Loomis considered frontrunner. Former Lt. Governor Henry Gunderson (P-Portage), a man from Eau Claire [whose name Alfonsi could not recall], Alfonsi, and Sen. Philip Nelson from Superior also in the race. Alfonsi supporters felt Nelson was in the race to divide Northern vote. Alfonsi spent $2400 which was not enough for a gubernatorial race. Alfonsi also hurt by Italy joining the Axis and the image of Mussolini. Heil defeated Loomis in 1940 but Loomis won election in 1942. Alfonsi supported him and was slated to become his executive secretary but Loomis died of a heart attack before taking office.
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Tape/Side
2/1
Time
06:10
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Farmer Labor Progressive Federation
: Alfonsi felt they were big help to the Party but was not active in the Federation. Was close to Amlie and supported him in the 1938 U.S. Senate primary.
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Tape/Side
2/1
Time
08:00
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AFL and CIO organizing in Iron County
: Basically occurred in the years after Alfonsi left the area and led to Democratic Party inroads in Iron County.
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Tape/Side
2/1
Time
10:10
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The Madison Ring
: Alfonsi did not associate with the group, feeling that some of them would be of no help to his people. As a whole they did not do the prestige of the party any good.
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Tape/Side
2/1
Time
11:25
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William Evjue
: Evjue always said he wanted to keep the party honest. Alfonsi found him inconsistent; was not one of the men he admired.
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Tape/Side
2/1
Time
13:00
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Theodore Damman
: A warhorse who did not get the credit he deserved.
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Tape/Side
2/1
Time
13:35
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Sol Levitan
: A nice old man.
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Tape/Side
2/1
Time
14:00
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The Young Progressives
: Did outstanding job for the party and many of them later elected to office. Many times crucial to the success of the party.
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Tape/Side
2/1
Time
15:00
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The decline of the Progressive Party
: The need for the Progressive Party declined because the conservative wing of the Republican Party became more liberal and closer to the Progressives. Right now Wisconsin is a moderate Republican state and the differences between parties much less than in 1934 when the Progressive Party was formed.
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Tape/Side
2/1
Time
17:00
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Assessment of Progressive Party experience
: No regrets. Progressives firmly committed to fiscal responsibility. La Follette would submit three budget proposals, A, B, and C reflecting differing levels of expenditures, but he would not sign an unbalanced budget. Progressives stood for what Alfonsi still believes in. He is a fiscal conservative, but his heart bleeds for those who need help through no fault of their own.
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Tape/Side
2/1
Time
20:10
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Reflections of his later career as a Republican
: Miles McMillan criticized him for not running as Democrat, but Alfonsi has no regrets returning to Republican Party.
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Tape/Side
2/1
Time
21:20
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National third party movements in the thirties
: Alfonsi had no interest in any of them and disapproved of them. Endorses two party system. Third and fourth parties weaken the issues and confuse the voters.
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Tape/Side
2/1
Time
23:40
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Justification for joining State Progressive Party
: Joining the Progressive Party did not deprive one of acting as Democrat or Republican in Presidential contests. Also the conservative wing of the Republican Party had become so haughty it practically forced the progressive Republicans out. Alfonsi did not want to be a mugwump anymore.
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Tape/Side
2/1
Time
25:20
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Support for Franklin Roosevelt
: Alfonsi supported Roosevelt in 1932 and 1936 but supported Wilkie in 1940.
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Tape/Side
2/1
Time
26:15
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End of Tape 2, Side 1
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Tape/Side
2/2
Time
00:00
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Introduction
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Tape/Side
2/2
Time
00:30
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Party competition in the 1930s
: The 1934 elections reflected the split in the Republican party while time allowed the Republicans to recover their strength. In the 1950s the Republicans abused the rules of fair play and paid for it in the 1970s.
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Tape/Side
2/2
Time
04:50
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Costello and Hones
: Emil Costello of the CIO and Kenneth Hones of the Farmer's Union both personal friends of Alfonsi. They may have attended Communist meetings but they were fine gentlemen and spoke for their constituencies. The issue was used against Alfonsi by Evjue and McMillan.
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Tape/Side
2/2
Time
08:05
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Lemke's 1936 Union Party campaign
: No effect at all in the state. Walter Graunke from Wausau supported their ticket. Graunke “sometimes went off the deep end but was a good warhorse.”
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Tape/Side
2/2
Time
10:25
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End of Tape 2, Side 2. End of Interview
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Audio 903A
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Series: Gordon Sinykin
98 minutes
: Interview with lawyer Sinykin conducted June 3, 1981, concerning his close association with Phil La Follette, party origins, political campaigns and tactics, William Evjue, Thomas Duncan, Ralph Immell, and other Progressive leaders, the National Progressives of America, and the demise of the party.
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Tape/Side
1/1
Time
00:00
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Introduction
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Tape/Side
1/1
Time
00:30
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Family and educational background
: Born in Madison, Wisconsin in 1910, youngest of four children. Father was a peddler. Sinykin educated in Madison schools and University of Wisconsin through law school. Always interested in politics and the La Follettes. Parents strongly supported the elder La Follettes' opposition to World War I.
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Tape/Side
1/1
Time
03:10
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First contact with Phil La Follette
: Attended meetings of the Progressive Club on the University campus and Phil spoke there. Phil also taught a course in criminal law at the Law School, and then when he became governer, Glenn Roberts took over the course. Sinykin attended campaign meetings in Watertown in 1932, where Phil spoke, and decided he wanted to help on the La Follette campaign. Sinykin had been working for Ralph Immell in Adjutant General's office but volunteered to help La Follette. He became Phil La Follette's driver for the 1932 campaign. After that defeat, Sinykin finished up law school and worked at Phil's law firm: La Follette, Rogers, and Roberts.
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Tape/Side
1/1
Time
09:30
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Origins of Progressive Party
: By 1933, Sinykin was practicing law and became involved in political meetings. Discussions centered around whether to remain in Republican Party, found new party, or go into Democratic Party. Conference held in Madison in March 1934, and sentiment was strong for new party Phil and Sinykin began legal action on how to do this by asking Supreme Court for original jurisdiction. Court handed down decision outlining procedures to start a new party. Conference held in Fond du Lac and decision made to go ahead with new party, although there was debate over whether the name should be Progressive or Farmer Labor. Progressives then went out and filed petitions on June 18, the anniversary of the death of the elder La Follette (also Sinykin's birthday).
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Tape/Side
1/1
Time
14:45
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Amlie and Farmer Laborites as Stalking Horse
: Who would be gubernatorial candidate? La Follette family, including Bob, felt Phil should not run in 1934 because Bob was up that year. Amlie and Evjue both mentioned, but Amlie wanted to run for Congress. Evjue liked being asked, but did not want to give up role as crusading editor of the Capital Times. Amlie, while active nationally, and in his district for third party, did not go around the state as Phil did.
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Tape/Side
1/1
Time
18:45
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1934 campaign
: Uphill fight in 1934. In 1932, Sinykin was on the go with Phil every day (they took a few Sundays off to come back to Madison and rest) from July to mid-September. They made every county in the state. Phil would make five speeches a day and often had a leadership meeting too. Bob also out making about three speeches a day. In 1934, Sinykin stayed in Madison. Sinykin wrote releases for the locals and AP. Sinykin ran personal campaigns of Phil and Bob, doing scheduling, press and fund raising. A lot of volunteer enthusiasm.
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A.W. Zaretsky
: Developed expertise in direct mail. State organized in precincts with precinct captains. Immell and Zaretsky organized letters to different groups. Also brought in Wheeler, Norris, and La Guardia. Farley's machine against Progressives. Democrats in Wisconsin just as conservative as the Republicans. FDR praised Bob and Schmedeman. He said he didn't want to win if Phil didn't, and that it was more important for Phil to win than himself. But all the Progressives worked hard.
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Tape/Side
1/1
Time
27:50
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End of Side 1
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Tape/Side
1/2
Time
00:00
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Introduction
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Tape/Side
1/2
Time
00:30
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1934 campaign
: Enthusiam of Progressives around the state very inspiring. Wondered about impact of Schmedeman's last-minute accident. Bob's victory was clear immediately but Phil's was not known until next day and the margin was very close. Sinykin remembers telegrams arriving in bushel baskets from all over the country and around the world. Did not raise much money and it did not take much money to run the type of campaigns the La Follettes ran. No television and did not use much radio or fancy literature.
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Tape/Side
1/2
Time
04:10
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1936 campaign
: Phil ran for re-election and Sinykin ran his campaign from the Governor's office. Mich easier to run when in office. Progressives riding a crest and Phil won easily.
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Tape/Side
1/2
Time
05:20
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Progressive campaign tactics
: Each county had a Progressive committee or club and Sinykin would write ahead to the officers to say that Phil or Bob would be available at a time on a day and local officers would pick the place to meet. Easier to draw a crowd in those days, since there weren't distractions such as television, bingo and that sort of thing. The meeting would become a social event for the community. Local officers responsible for getting publicity, a band, etc. Madison would send out brochures. Phil would arrive at 10:00AM; his driver would find local Progressive officer, local editor, leave release, hand out literature. Phil would speak, then shake hands but often on such a tight schedule he would have to leave right away. Also would send out other speakers: Sol Levitan, Spike Loomis, Ted Dammenn. Often the others would want to appear with a La Follette and Sinykin would argue that that was a waste. If they all went out separately they would multiply their effort. Sol Levitan especially would contrive to get on with Phil or Bob. At night they'd hold leadership meetings with 50-100 leaders to discuss strategy. In larger cities speeches were longer. This type of campaign enabled you to reach a lot of voters without having to rely on media.
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Tape/Side
1/2
Time
13:40
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Phil as campaigner
: Phil very quiet between speeches and had a thing about drinking orange juice. In 1932 Sinykin would have to make sure that the thermos was always full which proved difficult in some of the smaller towns. Phil would try to nap between stops and Sinykin would spend days without talking to him. Phil was a light eater and would eat very fast and Sinykin had a hard time finishing his food.
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Tape/Side
1/2
Time
16:25
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Bob's campaign style
: More relaxed than Phil and more talkative and outgoing. Get to bed as soon as possible. Driver's responsibility to end night meetings early since they had to get up at 6:00 the next morning. Bob started his campaigning a couple of weeks after Phil and did not like it as much. But after he got into it he was okay. Phil was a fiery eloquent orator who got wound up while Bob was much more quiet. Bob was like a ballet dancer with his gestures.
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Tape/Side
1/2
Time
19:40
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Old Bob
: Only time Sinykin saw old man was when he was lying in state. Mother took him up to the Capitol to see him and the crowd stretched all the way around the square.
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Tape/Side
1/2
Time
20:45
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William Evjue
: Sinykin did not have much to do with Evjue. Before Phil had become governor, Phil and Evjue were close personal friends. Evjue best as a critical editor and their roles hurt their friendship. Very effective as editor of the Capital Times and as a spokesman of progressive or liberal causes. Became quite a supporter of Roosevelt in large part due to Phil, who in 1936 suggested FDR call Evjue and the call overwhelmed Evjue. Final break came over special session, National Progressives.
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Tape/Side
1/2
Time
26:05
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Effect of special session
: Bad effect even though it accomplished several things. Together with the recession, the NPA and simple things had a bad effect on 1938 election.
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Tape/Side
1/2
Time
26:50
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End of Tape 1, Side 2
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Tape/Side
2/1
Time
00:00
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Introduction
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Tape/Side
2/1
Time
00:30
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Thomas M. Duncan
: An only child from Milwaukee. Duncan worked at the First Wisconsin National Bank in Milwaukee, resigning to become secretary to socialist mayor Dan Hoan. He was later elected to the senate when Phil La Follette was elected governor, and became executive secretary in La Follette's first term. He knew a lot about legislative parliamentary procedure and state finances. He was a socialist who thought that the Progressive movement could accomplish much good. He was responsible for enlisting the support of the Milwaukee socialists for the Progressives.
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Tape/Side
2/1
Time
03:40
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Duncan ran Milwaukee Leader
: Leader was a financially ailing socialist newspaper published by Victor Berger, a socialist congressman. Later, Sinykin assisted Duncan. The paper's business manager was Elmer Krahm. Krahm was very important in Progressive movement for his political leadership, managerial skills and adeptness at politicking. Things did not go well for Duncan after he killed someone in an auto accident. He worked for American Federation of Labor in Washington. He helped Andrew J. Biemiller get a job there.
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Tape/Side
2/1
Time
06:05
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Duncan “ran the show” in the legislature
: He was Phil La Follette's liason with the Progressives in the legislature as well as with sympathetic Democrats during the special session. He got idea of literally stopping the clock in one house so that Progressive legislation could be enacted despite the fact that the session's fixed adjournment date had passed. Drew a lot of criticism.
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Tape/Side
2/1
Time
08:45
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Paul R. Alfonsi
: Speaker of the Assembly. Very sharp, aggressive, energetic, highly respected.
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Tape/Side
2/1
Time
09:20
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Ralph M. Immell
: Came from Trempeleau County. Went to law school in Madison. He was a large man, 6'4" tall. Sinykin worked for him. Immell entered executive office when John J. Blaine was governor and was appointed adjutant general. He had extraordinary administrative ability, a strong personality, and was outgoing. He was undisciplined in personal habits and worked at all hours. He was a demanding administrator. Immell became chairperson of the Conservation Commission, predecessor of the Department of Natural Resources; greatly reformed its inefficient and corrupt management. He later made director of Works Project Administration. He was politically liberal and an excellent administrator. Served in World War II. In 1946, he resigned as adjutant general and ran for governor. He, among many others, advised Phil La Follette on the National Progressives of America movement. He was a good friend of A.W. Zeratsky and Gordon Sinykin.
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Tape/Side
2/1
Time
15:25
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The National Progressives of America
: The initiative for the National Progressives movement came largely from Phil La Follette. The Progressives and even Bob La Follette Sr. had long thought that what was needed was a new political alignment in America. Phil La Follette called in Progressive leaders to discuss this possibility, first from Wisconsin and then from outside the state.
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Tape/Side
2/1
Time
17:55
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Problems with the NPA movement
: In 1938, Sinykin left executive office and returned to his law practice. He was asked to go to New York to raise money for the movement. He did, but it difficult to raise even small amount. La Follette believed that productivity was key to economic well-being. He chose an "X" in a circle as symbol of the movement. He thought he could use this as symbol for good as the Nazis had used swastika for evil purposes. Sinykin and others against the idea, but La Follette adamant and encouraged by Isabel, his Wife. Sinykin believed that use of symbol, labeled a circumscribed swastika by some critics, torpedoed the National Progressive movement.
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Tape/Side
2/1
Time
20:45
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1938 NPA rally in Madison, Wisconsin
: Sinykin denies that the [April 1938] NPA rally “smacked of fascism,” aside from the use of the symbol. He says only one big banner used and extra police were there because crowd so large. NPA groups formed in California, but were ephemeral. Phil La Follette traveled to several places, including Iowa, to promote NPA.
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Tape/Side
2/1
Time
24:20
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Effect of Thomas Duncan accident on NPA
: Sinykin disagrees with Paul Alfonsi that the Thomas Duncan manslaughter conviction played a large role in the demise of the NPA. After Duncan had served two years of his sentence, the D.A. reopened the case in order to extend Duncan's sentence because Duncan had been tried under wrong statute. Sinykin defended Duncan. Phil La Follette pardoned Duncan before leaving office.
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Tape/Side
2/1
Time
26:30
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Factors in the 1938 election
: Important factors in the 1938 election loss were the NPA movement, the special session, and the economic recession. Frank Murphy, the governor of Michigan sympathetic to Progressive goals, also lost his bid for reelection in 1938.
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End of Tape 2, Side 1
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Tape/Side
2/2
Time
00:00
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Introduction
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Tape/Side
2/2
Time
00:35
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Political climate in the pre-war years
: In the late 1930s economy got worse and unemployment rose, causing dissatisfaction. Then war changed everything. Bob was more against war than Phil. Orland Loomis won gubernatorial primary in 1940. Phil played some role in the campaign. Loomis was defeated in the general election, but then was elected in 1942. Died before he could take office.
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Tape/Side
2/2
Time
02:35
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Demise of the Progressives
: It difficult to develop opposition to Democrats while country at war. Progressives failed in that they did not develop a new echelon of leadership to replace the La Follettes. Harold Stafford of Chippewa Falls was a possible leader as were “labor people” of Milwaukee. Milwaukee labor leaders, particularly in CIO, supported the Democrats. The CIO strongly supported the war and alliance with Soviet Union. Thomas R. Amlie ran as Democrat in 1941. Paul Alfonsi ran as a Republican in 1942. State Senator Allen J. Busby ran as a Republican and a Progressive.
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Tape/Side
2/2
Time
04:14
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1946 election
: Bob La Follette was up for re-election in 1946. He was very discouraged after World War II; he thought that the Soviet Union had come out of the war in better shape than the United States. He made speeches which disturbed the CIO leadership, which had Communist leanings. Bob was working on a government reorganization bill with Nagorsne in Washington. The outlook for his re-election in Wisconsin not good. Progressive Party weak, so seemed advantageous to run as either Republican or Democrat. Bob not enthusiastic about either Party, and vacillated in his decision to run. He did not return to Wisconsin much, because, he said, he had to stay in Washington to get the Government Reorganization Bill passed. He finally returned about two weeks before election. Despite his minimal campaigning he lost by less than 6,000 votes.
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Tape/Side
2/2
Time
07:25
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Choosing a new party (the Portage convention)
: Phil opposed running as a Republican; he wanted to try to continue the Progressive Party. Many Progressive leaders met in the armory in Portage to discuss which Party best suited their needs. After much debate Bob decided to run as a Republican. He vehemently opposed the Democrats' war and peace policies, among them, bowing to Soviet demands. If Bob had entered the Democratic Party he would have gotten much support. Former Progressives Jim Doyle and Carl Thompson rebuilt the Democratic Party in Wisconsin. Phil La Follette did not attend the Portage convention. Bob had Sinykin called Phil in Madison and told him not to come to the convention. Phil did not like this. Much debate at convention over philosophical and political ramifications of joining the Democrats or Republicans or remaining Progressives. One argument for joining the Republicans was that it was very important to have a full slate of officers running at the county level. This was impossible on the Progressive ticket. Some at convention thought former Progressives could be most easily elected as Republicans. Others thought that Progressives should take over Democratic Party and build through that organization. Some supported continuing as Progressives. At the time, the Republicans were experiencing a growth of power. This was a factor in the final decision, but it was Bob's influence which decided the issue. Phil did not plan to run again as Progressive. His only active political involvement subsequent to the decision to go Republican was his support of Gen. Douglas MacArthur, and then of Earl Warren in the 1952 primary.
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Tape/Side
2/2
Time
14:10
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Overall assessment of the Progressives
: People in Progressive movement had a crusading spirit and were eager to bring about social and economic reforms through new political channels. Many Progressives made sacrifices for the cause. As World War II began, many Progressives felt discouraged and disappointed. The lack of post-La Follette leadership was also a problem. The Progressives would have done better to enter the Democratic Party in 1946.
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End of Tape 2. Side 2. End of Interview
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Audio 993A
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Series: Carl W. Thompson
38 minutes
: Interview with State Senator Thompson conducted September 22, 1981, concerning Phil La Follette, his gubernatorial staff, and family and friends; the Progressive Club at the University of Wisconsin; the 1937 split in the party; and events after the party dissolved in 1946.
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Tape/Side
1/1
Time
00:00
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Introduction
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Tape/Side
1/1
Time
00:30
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Organization and workings of Phil La Follette's office
: Mabel E. Griswold handled the correspondence. Charles M. Dow greeted and interviewed all visitors. A.W. Zeratsky, from La Crosse, handled mailings and was the first to apply the retail mail order technique of mass mailings to select groups, such as teachers or businessmen, to politics. Phil La Follette went to Washington to see Roosevelt, and told him about this strategy. The person to whom FDR delegated the task of composing a letter suitable for Roosevelt's purposes used virtually the same letter which La Follette had shown to Roosevelt. Thomas M. Duncan was another secretary. He was a former state senator, a former socialist, and very bright and able. Gordon Sinykin was La Follette's executive counsel.
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Tape/Side
1/1
Time
03:25
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Tommy Duncan
: Duncan planned how to get programs through the legislature. He was contact with the legislature. Duncan and Phil La Follette, driving in Milwaukee, hit and killed a man. Thompson did not know Duncan very well in the late 1930s because Thompson was working as a file clerk along with Cliff Pulvermacher, now in upper Michigan, and Pete Morrisey, who later became judge in Walworth County. Duncan extremely intelligent and excelled at legislative maneuvering. Once, the opposition was boycotting the legislature. Duncan proposed that all the bills be put together so that they could be passed on one motion before the opposition returned. That idea was never used.
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Tape/Side
1/1
Time
06:05
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Phil and Isen La Follette
: Thompson usually drove Isen, Phil's wife, to speaking engagements. Phil had a professional chauffeur. John Gaus, professor of political science at the University of Wisconsin, and Max Otto, professor of philosophy, were La Follette's two most frequent visitors. Elizabeth Brandeis Raushenbush, daughter of Justice Brandeis, and her husband, Paul A. Raushenbush, both professors of political science at the university, were also friends of the La Follettes.
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Tape/Side
1/1
Time
07:45
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The Progressive Club at the UW
: The Club was involved in state and university politics. Speakers, for example Bob and Phil La Follette and Tom Amlie, would address the monthly club meetings. The Progressives formed an independent group on campus and elected Jim Doyle and Ruth Doyle to board of The Daily Cardinal. They installed a new editor. After the next elections, that editor was fired. A strike edition of the paper was published for quite a while. Bob Gregeson was elected to the Union board on the platform that six cent hamburgers would cost five cents. The Progressives met regularly at a few tables in the Union. One regular was a farmer from Walworth county whose farm was foreclosed upon who was trying to go to law school. Other regulars were two brothers from Milwaukee and a man named Sonnenberg.
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Tape/Side
1/1
Time
11:25
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Motivation to join the Progressive Club
: Thompson, like many people, felt strongly about political issues and strongly supported the Progressive Party, FDR, and Phil La Follette. The Club was a close-knit group, much like a fraternity.
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Tape/Side
1/1
Time
13:00
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1934 campaign
: Thompson circulated petitions to put the Progressive Party on the ballot before the primary and immediately after the convention at which the party was formed. At the urging of Phil La Follette, Thompson went to see William T. Evjue and Charles Holmberg of the Capital Times to see about starting a Progressive Party paper in Dane County. He sold $15 ads to Progressive Party candidates and wrote the editorial. Charlie Holmberg wrote many of the stories.
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Tape/Side
1/1
Time
15:10
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Support for Progressives in Stoughton area
: Stoughton was overwhelmingly pro-La Follette. Lines were strongly drawn: people were either Progressive Republicans or Stalwart Republicans; there were few Democrats.
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Tape/Side
1/1
Time
17:05
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The late 1930s
: Thompson ran for city council, a non-partisan office, in 1939. Norman and Analise Clapp managed the campaign. The Capital Times endorsed Thompson and the Wisconsin State Journal opposed him. Thompson became chairperson of the Progressive Party in Dane County. The Party controlled the courthouse and was supported by labor, farmers, and university people.
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Tape/Side
1/1
Time
19:35
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1937 split in Progressive Party
: Phil La Follette never joined the Farmer-Labor-Progressive Federation because he did not want to appear radical. Andy Biemiller, labor, former socialists, and maybe some Farmer Union members were the backbone of the Farmer-Labor-Progressive Federation. Organized labor tried to organize a truckers coop at the Richland Center Creamery. This created such an uproar that the farm organizations divided into the more liberal Wisconsin Federation of Coops and the Wisconsin Council of Agriculture. For many years afterwards the Wisconsin Federation of Coops was identified with the Democrats, and the Wisconsin Council of Agriculture was identified with the Republicans.
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Tape/Side
1/1
Time
22:45
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Harold Groves
: Groves was a state senator and professor of economics at the University of Wisconsin in the 1930s. Considered the “godfather of Progressive taxation theory.”
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Tape/Side
1/1
Time
23:30
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Thomas R. Amlie
: Very popular with young Progressives. He used to give speeches at the university in favor of “production for use and not for profit.” He was by far the most liberal person elected to Congress from Wisconsin in that era. Amlie was very popular on campus in the 1938 senate election. His opponent, Herman L. Ekern was an older, more traditional, and well-entrenched Progressive.
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Tape/Side
1/1
Time
25:10
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1940 gubernatorial race
: Paul Alfonsi had strong support among Progressive students. Thompson was the assistant manager of Orland Loomis' campaign. He worked with Maurice B. Pasch, Harold E. Stafford, and Philip E. Nelson from Superior, a Republican until 1936. Nelson and Arthur Zimney, a Milwaukee Democrat, were wooed to the Progressive camp.
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Tape/Side
1/1
Time
26:10
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1946 and after
: Thompson was in the army from September 1942 until 1946. He was told in 1946 that his services were not needed for the campaign because Bob La Follette would easily win the election. La Follette did not campaign and lost. Thompson did not have contact with La Follette after that. La Follette was critical of Thompson's and others' work in the Democratic Party. He never helped Thompson when Thompson ran for governor and congress.
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Tape/Side
1/1
Time
28:25
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End of Tape 1, Side 1
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Tape/Side
1/2
Time
00:00
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Introduction
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Tape/Side
1/2
Time
00:30
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Glenn D. Roberts
: Very close to the La Follettes. He was Phil La Follette's law partner.
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Tape/Side
1/2
Time
01:00
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Thompson became Democrat after 1946 primary
: Thompson voted in the Republican primary in 1946. When La Follette was defeated, Thompson thought no one else in the Republican Party was interesting so he agreed to manage Democrat William G. Rice's Congressional campaign when asked by Andy Biemiller. Rice was a law professor at the university. Bob Henry defeated Rice and died shortly thereafter. A special election was held in which Thompson ran against Glenn R. Davis. Thompson lost by a small margin because, he says, he was unknown, not because he was unpopular. The same situation resulted in his loss of the gubernatorial race in 1948.
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Tape/Side
1/2
Time
04:50
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Campaign style in the 1930s
: In the 1930s, the Progressives spent little on campaigning, but spoke often throughout the state. Phil La Follette would speak to 600-1500 people at a time. This type of campaigning ended with the advent of television. In 1948 and 1950 Thompson spoke from platform trucks to very small crowds, although the newspaper coverage of the event was usually good.
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Tape/Side
1/2
Time
06:25
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La Follette's decision on which Party to join in 1946
: The Progressives were divided on which ticket to run on in 1946. One point of contention was foreign policy. La Follette did not think that the time was right to run on the Democratic ticket. He discussed alternatives with Thompson in 1945 or 1946; Thompson advised him to run as a Democrat.
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Tape/Side
1/2
Time
09:10
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End of Tape 1, Side 2
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End of Interview
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