INTERVIEWER'S INTRODUCTION

BIOGRAPHY
Scope and Content Note: Born in Sudan, Minnesota on the Iron Range in 1917. Father an iron ore miner. Mother bore 13 children, 10 of whom survived to adulthood. In March of 1927, family moved to Milwaukee. Father and two older brothers preceded them.

SCHOOLING
Scope and Content Note: Began in public school but wasn't able to make transition from small rural school to large urban school. Mother therefore enrolled him in Holy Trinity Catholic School. Went on to St. John's Cathedral High School and one year at State Teachers College. Realized he did not want to become a teacher.

FATHER'S WORK
Scope and Content Note: Father came from Yugoslavia when in his early 20's to Sudan and went to work immediately in the mines. Characterized as hard-working, god-fearing people. Kept a cow and a few pigs to supplement mine work. Fred is a “middle” child in birth order.

MOTHER'S MOVE TO MILWAUKEE
Scope and Content Note: When family moved to Milwaukee, Fred's mother sold house. Entire proceeds from the sale were required to pay off grocery bill and purchase fare to Milwaukee.

FAMILY'S RELIGION, POLITICS
Scope and Content Note: Very religious, Catholic family. Describes first communion. Got soda crackers and pop as a treat following first communion. Not political. Mother illiterate and could not speak English. Father learned English and could read from newspaper.

FRED IS FAMILY'S “PROFESSOR”
Scope and Content Note: Fred served as interpreter and clerk for mother when dealing with agencies like welfare. Relates incident of rent fraud: Fred pleaded his mother's case before the judge and won. As they left the courtroom, judge told Erchul he should be a lawyer when he grew up. Not interested in law but did want to be a medical doctor.

POST HIGH SCHOOL EDUCATION
Scope and Content Note: Received all conference honors in football and good grades in school, but unable to obtain a scholarship. Therefore forced to go to Normal College. Strongly motivated to educate self. Studied the Literary Digest to become knowledgeable on world affairs, finances, etc.

FAMILY ON COUNTY RELIEF
Scope and Content Note: During high school days he would have to carry county relief bag as his lunch bag. One of the only “poor” students at his high school. Later Erchul would argue in support of county aid in front of the County Board. Financed his high school education by selling newspapers the first year. Didn't like to miss extracurricular activities and arranged to get summer jobs at the school. During last two years he became backup janitor.

DESCRIBES SOUTHSIDE NEIGHBORHOOD
Scope and Content Note: Lived in area of Walker Square, which was populated mainly by Slovenians, a few Mexicans, and a few Greeks. Changed when Slovenians moved out. Now primarily Mexican and Puerto Ricans.

NEIGHBORHOOD CHURCHES, MUSIC
Scope and Content Note: Slovenian Church and Holy Trinity Church had Slovenian ministers. Erchul took mother to Slovenian mass; loved to sing hymn at the end because his mother would harmonize. [Sings the song.] Most of family musical. Still sing when they get together.

FARM JOB
Scope and Content Note: When seventeen years old referred to a farm job by state employment service. Got $1/day shocking grain. By the end of an 11 or 12 hour day he was so tired he could not straighten up.

INVOLVED IN BOY SCOUTS
Scope and Content Note: Loved scouts and became active leader.

DESCRIBES HIS VALUES
Scope and Content Note: Wanted to do more than “carry a lunch box and close eyes to the world.” Kept to himself and his schooling. Both mother and father encouraged Fred to study.

END OF TAPE 1, SIDE 1

INTERVIEWER'S INTRODUCTION

FAMILY'S STRUGGLE TO SUPPORT FRED'S EDUCATION
Scope and Content Note: Bought a jacket on time; paid 50 cents/week. Brothers all had to work, and teased Fred about his “favored” position (“sitting on his duff”) while they worked.

FAMILY'S ATTITUDES TOWARD ORGANIZED LABOR
Scope and Content Note: No awareness of labor movement. No union in Iron Range. First awareness came with first job.

PLANKINTON PACKINGHOUSE
Scope and Content Note: Friend of family told Erchul to go to packinghouse. Lied about age and got a temporary job for the fall of 1937 in the meat cutting department. Married in 1938 and took part-time job at printing shop. Went back to Plankinton whenever they called in order to build seniority.

MARRIAGE
Scope and Content Note: When married in 1938, did not have a job. Wife worked in printing shop for $10/week. Relates how he met his wife. Went to pick up neighbor girl of sixteen just released from hospital after recovering from scarlet fever. “From that first sight she was my girl.” Childhood sweethearts. Had large Slovenian wedding, replete with pillow dance, broom dance and a bushel basket full of groceries from Fred's mother.

WORK AT PLANKINTON
Scope and Content Note: Worked at Plankinton off and on for 5 years before he got a permanent job there. Had to do all sorts of filthy jobs in the interim. Work in hog department was relatively clean. Was shoulder sawyer; worked with big band saw and thumb generally 1/4 inch from blade. Lost half of his thumb; this was “part of the job.” Everyone had cuts. Safety equipment was neither adequate nor accepted by workers until mandatory.

FIRST UNION EXPERIENCE
Scope and Content Note: First approached while at Plankinton and joined Amalgamated Meatcutters and Butcher Workmen of America. Relates episode of union intervening on his behalf while he was still a temporary worker.

UNION ACTIVISM
Scope and Content Note: Passive member. Laid off during time when vote was taken between Amalgamated and Packinghouse Workers Organizing Committee (PWOC). When he returned the CIO-PWOC was in and AFL was out. Steward (Johnny Fesser) asked Erchul one day to attend a meeting in his stead. Erchul agreed. Marvelled at the important things which were being decided. Asked to become permanent “assistant” steward. Went to all membership meetings. Began reading everything about unions; was asked to run for recording secretary. He ran, helped by millwrights who campaigned on his behalf, and was elected, ousting an old-timer. From there he was “off to the races.” Studied all the correspondence. Loved the job, though it was hard work.

WORK AS RECORDING SECRETARY
Scope and Content Note: Had to take minutes at all meetings. Relates story of returning from meeting, having his wife type stencil, mimeograph 1000 copies and get them to the plant early the next morning. Finally got recognition for that work in the form of $10/month salary.

REASON FOR SUCCESS IN ELECTION
Scope and Content Note: His schooling qualified him to write letters, resolutions, book-keeping, etc.

END OF TAPE 1, SIDE 2

INTERVIEWER'S INTRODUCTION

LEADERSHIP IN LOCAL
Scope and Content Note: When Erchul first became involved in the union movement he found the leaders to be a group of dedicated men committed to labor movement. No “leftists” among them: Emil Saubstad was president, then Ed Schraeder. Schraeder counseled Erchul not to go too fast in taking on new responsibility.

STRIKE OF 1948
Scope and Content Note: Lasted 10-11 weeks and included “Big Four”: Wilson, Swift, Armour and Cudahy. Big rift between Amalgamated which had settled and UPW which wanted more. Strike was lost.

WORK ON CIO COUNTY COUNCIL
Scope and Content Note: Local invited to a “right wing” caucus to discuss ousting of “communist” leadership. Local had dropped out of the council because Ed Schraeder (president) disagreed with leadership. Local was first asked to re-affiliate so that voting strength would be adequate for ouster. Erchul, as recording secretary, went to all the meetings over a period of 2 or 3 years.

LEFT-WING USE OF “SOLIDARITY FOREVER” TO DROWN OUT OPPOSITION
Scope and Content Note: Whenever right-wing forces rose to speak, left-wing would burst out singing “Solidarity Forever,” preventing any discussion. Because associated with left-wing for a time.

RIGHT-WING CAUCUS MEMBERS AND LEADERSHIP
Scope and Content Note: Herman Steffes, Vincent Podlagar, Walter Cappel, Sid Rey, Glen Clark, John Sorenson. Leaders were Walter Cappel and Erchul. Erchul became secretary and spokesman for group; played a most active part. This leadership role was responsible for his later election to council. Describes his work in caucus.

DESCRIBES LEFT-WING CAUCUS
Scope and Content Note: Successful because of organization. Until creation of caucus, right-wing was not organized. Impression that Christoffel was “on the ball,” good speaker, and had the backing of “the troops.”

EFFECTS OF LEFT-WING ON UNION MOVEMENT
Scope and Content Note: “Tainted CIO with communist label.” Candidates asked not to be endorsed by CIO. Helped union movement by organizing workers. Worked with dedication, but also with intention of changing system (philosophy).

DESCRIBES PERSONAL RESPONSE TO LEFT-WING
Scope and Content Note: Outraged by left-wing determination to change government. “I'm just a regular guy. I go to church. I believe in the union movement. I couldn't understand it.”

TALKS ABOUT LEADERSHIP AND HIS ROLE AFTER OUSTER OF LEFT-WING
Scope and Content Note: Momblow was an older gentleman. Arthur Conn did not stay active. Erchul was on executive board of state and the council. Very busy and well informed. First full-time union job was selling ads for Christmas edition of CIO News. Made about twice as much as he would have at Plankinton. Divisions within movement after ouster of left-wing were based on personality.

END OF TAPE 2, SIDE 1

INTERVIEWER'S INTRODUCTION

FACTIONS WITHIN COUNCIL--STATE AND MILWAUKEE
Scope and Content Note: Few ideological divisions. Steffes defeated on personality issues. The same group which supported Schultz passed a motion for Erchul to vote a certain way. Erchul resigned over the issue and became a delegate from the local. CIO different from AFL in that elections were always contested.

ERCHUL OPPOSED THREE TIMES
Scope and Content Note: Always won because of honesty, dedication to helping delegates, avoidance of sex scandal, and always being responsible to delegates' letters and requests.

WORK WITH ROBERT JORDAN
Scope and Content Note: [December 10 interview session begins here.] Erchul (secretary-treasurer) was only full-time union official. Robert Jordan was an older man with college education, “very savvy” but also very egotistical. This made it difficult for Erchul because he was often asked to represent Council, even though Jordan was president. Describes disagreement.

COUNCIL FINANCES
Scope and Content Note: No cash reserves. Lived from per capita to per capita. Would have to call unions (Local 75, in particular) for an advance. Finally asked for per capita increase. First time defeated, second time threatened with closing office, and increase granted.

HATE MAIL AND STRESS OF JOB
Scope and Content Note: Dismisses hate mail as an everyday occurrence. Relates response to civil rights program: threatened with bomb, obscene phone calls to family. Erchul developed ulcers. At times he would return home and tell wife problems and cry.

PUBLIC SPEAKING PUTS STRESS ON FAMILY LIFE
Scope and Content Note: Took a lot of time to speak at local meetings, high schools, and for United Way speakers bureau. Never an eight hour day. Never had time for personal life. Seldom saw children after becoming full-time union employee. Children disappointed when he was re-elected because they saw him more when he worked in plant.

POLITICAL ACTIVITY
Scope and Content Note: Political action was a priority of CIO. Helped Carl Thompson in his campaign for governor. Helped “hundreds” who ran for office.

END OF TAPE 2, SIDE 2

INTERVIEWER'S INTRODUCTION

POLITICAL ACTIVITIES OF COUNCIL
Scope and Content Note: CIO was activist, AFL not. Attended Political Action Committee which endorsed candidates. Organized canvassing at neighborhood for get-out-the-vote, and support of chosen candidates. Registration drives held; absentee ballot use encouraged.

BEGINNING OF LABOR'S POLITICAL LEAGUE (LPL)
Scope and Content Note: WSFL and CIO felt that dual set of endorsements was confusing. Thus LPL was organized. Invited any labor organization to join. Executive committee elected according to membership. Included AFL, CIO, and a few smaller organizations. J. F. Friedrick was president; Erchul was secretary. AFL and CIO were not divided. After merger, LPL became COPE. Citizen's Non-Partisan Conference on Political Action was predecessor of LPL. Fell apart because it was “taking in farm groups.” Didn't have cohesion.

LABOR PRESS
Scope and Content Note: AFL Labor Press before merger didn't print political information. After merger this changed.

OPINION OF HABERMAN'S POLITICS
Scope and Content Note: Common knowledge that he favored Republicans, though motivations were unclear.

CIO COUNCIL AND HUMAN RIGHTS
Scope and Content Note: Very involved in civil rights and community services. Had full-time person working at United Way. Trained shop people to work on non-shop problems of workers. Commitment to public information.

CATLIN ACT (NO-RAIDING ACT)
Scope and Content Note: Created quite a stir; labor lobbied hard to get it repealed. Council not involved in raiding disputes or organizing. Left organizing to internationals.

MERGER OF MILWAUKEE FEDERATED TRADES COUNCIL AND COUNTY IUC
Scope and Content Note: Simplified because of work in Labor's Political League. Big stumbling block was Labor Press. CIO wanted subscription to be voluntary. Describes process of merger.

END OF TAPE 3, SIDE 1

INTERVIEWER'S INTRODUCTION

CONTINUATION OF MERGER
Scope and Content Note: Newspaper issue resolved in January of 1960. Combined council had 130,000 members. Very little personal animosity; smooth transition. Board consisted of 9 from AFL and 6 from CIO but there was never a vote settled 9 to 6. Labor's Political League helped bring two together.

WORKING OF MERGED COUNCIL
Scope and Content Note: Never any difficulty working with J. Friedrick and Stanley Joers. High quality leadership, worked well as a team. Erchul's door was “always open to those with problems.” Meetings attended by 40 percent to 60 percent of delegates.

JAKE FRIEDRICK
Scope and Content Note: Taught Erchul many things and helped mold Erchul's thinking. Gives example of lesson he learned from Friedrick. Never heard a negative comment about him. Always honest, calm and knowledgable. “One in a million man.”

FRIEDRICK'S OPPOSITION TO HABERMAN IN 1946
Scope and Content Note: Supposes Friedrick's defeat was due to his liberal politics and his industrial union background.

DECAY OF SLOVENIAN NEIGHBORHOOD AND ITS EFFECT ON UNION
Scope and Content Note: Little effect on labor movement. But once workers moved to suburbs and had two cars in the garage, they became less interested in problems of workers.

LABOR AND RACISM
Scope and Content Note: Racism was a factor in labor support for George Wallace. Leadership in favor of human and civil rights, but rank and file more resistant to integration. Tells story of racism in Slovenian neighborhood. Open housing campaign a very difficult one. Picketed, wrote articles and worked hard in the face of much harassment from whites opposed to open housing.

PARTICIPATION IN LAND COMMISSION
Scope and Content Note: Asked by mayor personally to serve on commission. Served 1953 to 1979. Felt that he was able to serve labor in that position. Felt there was need for industrial development rather than apartment housing. Established a land bank.

END OF TAPE 3, SIDE 2

INTERVIEWER'S INTRODUCTION

ACTIVITIES OF MILWAUKEE PLAN COMMISSION
Scope and Content Note: Development of Marine Plaza. Fought hard for months to get project approved. Another project which fell through after digging for foundation became “Erchul's hole.”

ROLE OF CHURCH IN ERCHUL'S CAREER
Scope and Content Note: Besides union activities also trustee of church and secretary of Holy Name Society. Took his pride of being an active Catholic into his labor activities. Used to take references to labor from the Pope's encyclicals to use in speeches. Once had religion used against him in an election.

MAX RASKIN
Scope and Content Note: Counsel for state CIO. Would work for nothing if a legal problem came up for county council. He was a “friend of the working man.”

HEALTH PROBLEMS
Scope and Content Note: Erchul lived with ulcers. In order to continue working he would leave the room and take cream and milk to soothe the ulcer. Eventually had to have 3/4 of stomach removed. Used to have high blood pressure but has been fine since he moved to the lake. Erchul has severed all connections with labor movement; is in complete retirement. Forced to retire early because of cancer of the blood and was not expected to live long.

REFLECTS ON LONG CAREER
Scope and Content Note: One essential aid which kept him working was the complete support of his wife. “I loved the movement....I loved working with people.” Greatest satisfaction was bringing together all of the Milwaukee movement in the course of merger. To see Walter Reuther and George Meany hold hands upraised at merger convention was most thrilling moment.

END OF TAPE 4, SIDE 1

INTERVIEWER'S INTRODUCTION

CONTINUES REFLECTING ON CAREER
Scope and Content Note: “Whole career was memorable.” When he retired, he was the last of the original five leaders of the merger. Was pleased when after he retired he was acknowledged as the “Singing Secretary.” Used to be booed by audiences when introduced--“love boos.” Describes singing incident. Used to compose songs for retirees and sing them at dinners. Also composed song for United Way labor drive. [Sings the song.]

RETIREMENT: “SING ALONG WITH FRED”
Scope and Content Note: Retired in April of 1979; dinner held on May 12th. Erchul requested simple dinner with no speeches. Instead Erchul led group in community singing.

END OF INTERVIEW